power classes

First topic message reminder :

be open minded dont kill me on this one , this is only meant to stop the arguing about 12 volt or 16 volt , also what amp is legal or not . this is only an idea , would this bring new blood into sport by making it less expensive .it make it a more even playing field and make it about the build.....again only an idea . looking for you to chose not flame...

the ones that are loud now will still woop ure asses you cant stop that period, and here is why they have 5-10 years in there vehicles/they spend countless hours testing/and they spend more money than most can emagine on testing.

happens every year people cry about this or that, and then things get changed for them, and they are fornicating no shows at finals.

PUSSIES

sanman wrote:

the ones that are loud now will still woop ure asses you cant stop that period, and here is why they have 5-10 years in there vehicles/they spend countless hours testing/and they spend more money than most can emagine on testing.

happens every year people cry about this or that, and then things get changed for them, and they are fornicating no shows at finals.

PUSSIES

I agree, S-10s and CRX and Astros are loud because over the last 10 years, people have put alot of time and effort in testing testing testing. They are not EASY to get loud. You can get them louder quicker simply because MOST of the secrets are out on what to do and what NOT to do.
There very well could be some louder vehicals out there but no one has put the time into them... YET...

no whats going to happen is all the "builders" with less power are going to beat everyone with "cheater" amps, who have been winning right?????? oh wait....the loud will still be loud and the not so loud will still lose and find something to "Female dog" about next year.

How about we try and run regionals correctly now before we move on too anything else. Do I really need to explain the problems we already have at the regionals

And if u can run a no wall van why could u not run a Tahoe and take all the seats out and run a Tahoe no wall

hunterw wrote:

TECH114 wrote:

Where was this said? Is usaci following midwestspl?

its becoing midwestspl/dbdrag from what ive heard may happen

Midwest SPL has CLAMPED POWER CLASSES
I see nothing from dB drag

USACI sends amps to be tested to keep it fair.
Some amps are modified to get around the rules.
WE ARE NOT DOING CLAMPED CLASSES LIKE MIDWEST SPL
FYI - People used power clamps for years to test amps - long before MIDWEST SPL existed.

USACI is going to try and level the playing field by catching people who mod amps and mis-label or under-rate amps. There is no legitimate argument against keeping people from cheating, unless of course it is the people who are getting away with it who are unhappy.

USACI has 4 ohm power classes and will continue to.

Team Big'Un wrote:

How about we try and run regionals correctly now before we move on too anything else. Do I really need to explain the problems we already have at the regionals

And if u can run a no wall van why could u not run a Tahoe and take all the seats out and run a Tahoe no wall

1. You could run that Tahoe.
2. There a many regionals. Which ones are you talking about? What was wrong with them? What can be done to fix em?

Dont throw it out there without clarification and more important, a solution.

USACI wrote:

hunterw wrote:

TECH114 wrote:

Where was this said? Is usaci following midwestspl?

its becoing midwestspl/dbdrag from what ive heard may happen

Midwest SPL has CLAMPED POWER CLASSES
I see nothing from dB drag

USACI sends amps to be tested to keep it fair.
Some amps are modified to get around the rules.
WE ARE NOT DOING CLAMPED CLASSES LIKE MIDWEST SPL
FYI - People used power clamps for years to test amps - long before MIDWEST SPL existed.

USACI is going to try and level the playing field by catching people who mod amps and mis-label or under-rate amps. There is no legitimate a

rgument against keeping people from cheating, unless of course it is the people who are getting away with it who are unhappy.


.

letting in no wall vans into prostock (which is a rumor ive heard) is the dbdrag part.

and you can come test my amps any day of the week. im all legit. its not going to keep people from cheating. and you will never level the playing field. the competitors will still win and the people that lose will still "Female dog". so eventually all usaci will be is silly classes with silly rules. but honestly.....how many people really mislabel their amps or mod them???ive never seen or heard of that. well i cant wait to see what the ruling is.



next year the crx and s10 class will a rule

We will see how it turns out. My guess, no one will notice the changes.

As for "modding or mis-labeling amps, we have several verified recorded events of just that. One manufacturer is still only allowed in USACI unlimited as a result of 5 amps, all rated different, and all with the same exact board from the factory. That is just one account. Another added internal adjustments to turn the amps power output up after purchasing. Caught that during a bech test.

It is in fact common.

Funny how many manufaturers say sound offs are not doing anything for their business and then they spend so much time and R&D building their product to give them a competative edge in sound competitions.

there was one thing that was thrown out there that i know that would help make it easy and would save u some money from having to send amps off for testing and would help out with the new blood coming into the game, is just go off the 1 ohm rating of a amp and thats the class u are in then it would put it in the competoirs court to make that amp put that out, all amps that put out good power come out with the cn4 stamp on the box ( i thionk its called cn4 or cm4 ) i know that may ster up alot of guys but just think about it

aho77 wrote:

there was one thing that was thrown out there that i know that would help make it easy and would save u some money from having to send amps off for testing and would help out with the new blood coming into the game, is just go off the 1 ohm rating of a amp and thats the class u are in then it would put it in the competoirs court to make that amp put that out, all amps that put out good power come out with the cn4 stamp on the box ( i thionk its called cn4 or cm4 ) i know that may ster up alot of guys but just think about it

The problem is you would have to trust that the 1ohm rating is correct. If that was the case we could trust the 4ohm rating. It is just as easy to sandbag on one rating as the other.

If every amp actually did what it was rated at we would not be having any of these discussions. everything would be much more fair.

Good thinking though. I hope we find a solution some day.

i understand what u mean just thrown anther idea out there for the female dogs i dont care i have been legit all year and and dont have no desire to go get one of those amps or a rex i have been told all season i have been going about my build the hard way

USACI wrote:

Team Big'Un wrote:

How about we try and run regionals correctly now before we move on too anything else. Do I really need to explain the problems we already have at the regionals

And if u can run a no wall van why could u not run a Tahoe and take all the seats out and run a Tahoe no wall

1. You could run that Tahoe.
2. There a many regionals. Which ones are you talking about? What was wrong with them? What can be done to fix em?

Dont throw it out there without clarification and more important, a solution.

We went to Tyler, Austin, Padre, if Heatwave is still a Regional who knows.

Padre I am doing a WR run and I am waiting on someone playing Mafia Wars while my voltage keeps dropping and we can't ever seem to get SB runs right at this show, one reason we quit running SB I did like a 34 in SB5 at this show hmmm wonder if someone knows how to work a compuer

Austin just speaks for itsef people in the wrong classes, and ur allowed to run every class with one vehicle. And u have to run 3 to 6 times to get the correct SB score

Tyler on the oher hand was just too slow there would be people im the lanes and there would be no one around running the show

As far as fixing them I think u have made some moves towards that already at least what I have heard, maybe the directors should take a class to be certified and know all the rules and yes the competitors should know them also

Thx for clarrifing that tahoe

As for what I have read about it (and trust me other than what I read I don't know much about it) clamped power would only be at regionals and finals, well what if you are on the west coast where there are no regionals and you compete all year in one class but you go to finals (which I do) and they tell you sorry wrong class here is the class you really have to compete in. There has got to be a better way for people to know what their true clamped power is before finals and this is just observation on my part.

As far as Big'Un's regional comment I think I remember something about a Hummer with a wall and a ton of power competing in a stock class at Heatwave or something? I remember Ralph postaed later the situation was remedied... but after the show

So herea question u run that class all year, u get to finals they tell u sorry ur in the wrong class because of clamped power, now U have no points for that class, so u can't run that class at Finals right.

For $150 anyone can purchase the clamp and power meter and test their system.

USACI could also make the meters avaialble at all local shows for you to clamp there if you just want to know waht power you are doing without spending the $150. With what most competitors spend on their system the cost of the meters is not even on radar.

So with your reply, does that mean it will be one of the new rules?

If it is, how do u go about checking your amps. USACi rate an amp 500 w at 12 volt. Now that same amp is run at 16 Volts up, obviously you will get more power out of it. If you run it at .25,.33,.5,.75 ohms etc, you will get different output from your amps. How exactly is this going to be checked?

USACI wrote:

For $150 anyone can purchase the clamp and power meter and test their system.

USACI could also make the meters avaialble at all local shows for you to clamp there if you just want to know waht power you are doing without spending the $150. With what most competitors spend on their system the cost of the meters is not even on radar.

are you seriously gonna test my amp and possibly dq someone with a fornicating $150 clamp and multimeter. where you going to shop kmart or harbor freight?

Talonesi wrote:

USACI wrote:

For $150 anyone can purchase the clamp and power meter and test their system.

USACI could also make the meters avaialble at all local shows for you to clamp there if you just want to know waht power you are doing without spending the $150. With what most competitors spend on their system the cost of the meters is not even on radar.

are you seriously gonna test my amp and possibly dq someone with a fornicating $150 clamp and multimeter. where you going to shop kmart or harbor freight?

Ebay

TECH114 wrote:

So with your reply, does that mean it will be one of the new rules?

If it is, how do u go about checking your amps. USACi rate an amp 500 w at 12 volt. Now that same amp is run at 16 Volts up, obviously you will get more power out of it. If you run it at .25,.33,.5,.75 ohms etc, you will get different output from your amps. How exactly is this going to be checked?

no, it tmeans we are considering it and gathering info on it.

Talonesi wrote:

USACI wrote:

For $150 anyone can purchase the clamp and power meter and test their system.

USACI could also make the meters avaialble at all local shows for you to clamp there if you just want to know waht power you are doing without spending the $150. With what most competitors spend on their system the cost of the meters is not even on radar.

are you seriously gonna test my amp and possibly dq someone with a fornicating $150 clamp and multimeter. where you going to shop kmart or harbor freight?

Nope, gonna have you donate one!

beatnoutdaframe wrote:

i don't see why this would be a big deal for anyone it will just show who can really build now and don't have to use cheater amps i love it

I totaly agree with this satement...

i could care less ive been under powerd goin against bigger more powerful amps sence day 1 .my 1 ma 4k was only 1db less then 8 mmats amps , 2 ss10ks kept up good with 8 kicker 2500s and beat 9 3k amps in another van , this year 2 dbdrive 7.5s beat 2 warhorses and 8 aq 3500s and 8 or 9 ma4ks , i love being the under dog ,

SO ROWLAND POWER REALLY DOESNT MEAN ANYTHING THEN HUH

lol .. not if ya work your ars off to get what ya got louder

that is a good answer The_Rowlands

As for me I was beating people with way more power than me(locally), until it came to finals where I would get stomped. I had 3 Memphis MC1.4000 and 3 mojo 15s, and never got beat all year long, then I go to finals and someone beats me by like 5dbs, that sucked. It is all in the build. The amps have something to do with it, but its 90 percent build. Right Sanman? Did you do a high number with 1 pf600 and then with the 3 rd9s, it wasnt that far off? I think I read that somewhere.

All I say is dont do away with 16volt batteries. I have too much invested. Thanks, oh and dont make me compete against the mod guys because I have 16 volt batteries. Apples to oranges.

OH NO 3 600'S WOULD DO 163.5 3 D9'S WOULD DO 163.9

I don't think there needs to be any new clases. I do think there should be a change in power . The only use we have 4 oam power rateing is the mid's and high's . I think if we changed the rateings to max power we could use more brands , insted of just brand x, y and z . This will bring more support from shops, manufactures and competors. Don't ban any amps! Just put them in classes they fit in to by max power ! Becaus no one is likind the clamped power idea !

Ok I dont agree with the clamp! Or using certain amps! You cant call them cheater amps, cause like a friend told me....."You can buy that same amp too, its all about research and knowing what your buying!" I agree! You think if you tell the cop that pulled you over for not having your seatbelt on in the backseat of a 1 ton truck, and you tell him you didnt know you had to wear one back there, he wont give you a ticket????? Hell no he will still write you one cause Ignorance of the law is no excuse! Same here! Leave the classes alone try not to change the rules! There are other ways of getting new members! Like maybe enforcing the rules better! I witnessed A hummer run trunk class at the austin heatwave last year???? HUMMER IN A TRUNK CLASS???? If we cant enforce what we already have, then why add/ change more stuff? Just my two cents

I couldn't vote on the poll, but i say lower classes

Not all, just for example maybe first year competitors could have a 0-300 STOCK, or a 0-500 MODIFIED class, and ONLY for first year competitors

And as far as clamping goes, can you imagine how much longer it would take to get everyone classified into the right class????
it takes long enough to just organize and coordinate a show the way it currently is.

and i know most of the guys going for clamping are saying it would be good for competitors new to USACi, but if they are new they most likely will not understand the clamping process and not be able to prepare before hand and most people new to car audio do not even have a DC clamp.

SO i say for there first year let them have their own class and after that year they should get the idea of things, and be able to hang

another suggestion is i think there should be a modified- no-wall -NO 16V class, because it really isn't fair competition for someone who has a box in rear over window line on 12v to be in same class as WALLED 16v beasts