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 KicxkerCRX

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BBGIC
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PostSubject: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 12:28 am

First topic message reminder :

Edited by Ralph Randall on 11/01/2012 because I did not properly convey my thought previously. :-)

For the record, I deleted the account. I did not "BAN" the person who holds the account but just took action that I felt needed to be taken.
I only posted it on here so there would not be rumors of a "conspiracy" or other subterfuge to begin to surface. I deleted it and I had good reason.

The member is welcome to reestablish the account or contact me to get the old one back. If he/she does not then I will know I correct in removing it in the first place. If I was wrong I will accept that as well.

Thank you for your time and consideration on this matter,

USACI


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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 1:17 pm

bassahaulic wrote:
I haven't been on this forum in a while, and I can now honestly see why.


This is a bit on the ridiculous side, someone who spends so much time and money supporting something over such a long period of time should have a strong voice in what happens.

From what I can read, all he asked for was proof of something, and with this being a competition organization that shouldn't be an issue to begin with.



Anyone care to fill me in on what I have missed?

Where did you read that? Not what happened.

No, you have not missed anything that need filled in on.

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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 2:25 pm

So... let me interpret your first post (now edited):
Someone gets the ban-hammer. They choose not to beg for their name back. They must have made the whole thing up and are guilty.

Your logic is flawed. The validity of any accusations are independent of the speaker's actions.

If someone doesn't ask for their name back, it probably means they don't want to jeopardize their eligibility for real-life competition... since you've shown a propensity for over-reacting once.
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 2:38 pm




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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 4:38 pm

So now that you have (in not so many words) admitted to over reacting to the situation and now you know who it is, shouldnt you be calling him? He didnt really do anything that justified deleting his account.... Undelete it and move forward from this instead of trying to show how your in charge and people are gunna do as you request! The right thing may not always be the prideful thing....
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 5:39 pm

The Bald One's actions were somewhat justifiable... considering the seriousness of the accusations being thrown around. He has the power to act however he sees fit.

The members have the power to leave if they disapprove of USACi's actions, though.

If we're complacent with this, and don't demand some evidence or justification... it just means that we passively agree with USACi. That's fine, but Chad doesn't seem to be a sadist or a pathological liar.

How about some transparency? We're smart enough to read and decide if everyone's upfront and honest.

Did we fluff some numbers, unfairly support certain vendors, improperly schedule events, forget to pay taxes, miss some world records, etc. Even if we did something, was it for self-preservation or for profit? Until the facts get out there... the whole organization's credibility is left to chance.
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 6:19 pm

The detailed conversation i had with Chad this morning left nothing un clear study
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 6:36 pm

chrisbaldelli wrote:
The Bald One's actions were somewhat justifiable... considering the seriousness of the accusations being thrown around. He has the power to act however he sees fit.

The members have the power to leave if they disapprove of USACi's actions, though.

If we're complacent with this, and don't demand some evidence or justification... it just means that we passively agree with USACi. That's fine, but Chad doesn't seem to be a sadist or a pathological liar.

How about some transparency? We're smart enough to read and decide if everyone's upfront and honest.

Did we fluff some numbers, unfairly support certain vendors, improperly schedule events, forget to pay taxes, miss some world records, etc. Even if we did something, was it for self-preservation or for profit? Until the facts get out there... the whole organization's credibility is left to chance.

Guy, stop with all of the "big word" talk. While you're at it spit the SA CK out. It is what it is. How many times did Ralph log in or even look when Alan mentioned change in the org.

Know what? We haven't gotten some input from the Man's mouthpiece himself on this one.

Odd?


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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 6:37 pm

Guess I didnt know there was a deeper message to what was being said.... But ya if that kinda crap is going on, then thats really not good!
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 6:56 pm

every action has a reaction
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 8:02 pm

Ralph you say you didn't know it was chad, however his name was in his signature.

Did you call him and ask about this "hidden agenda" for his post?

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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 8:06 pm

Jeff Sanford wrote:
Ralph you say you didn't know it was chad, however his name was in his signature.
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 9:27 pm

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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 10:41 pm

chrisbaldelli wrote:
So... let me interpret your first post (now edited):
Someone gets the ban-hammer. They choose not to beg for their name back. They must have made the whole thing up and are guilty.

Your logic is flawed. The validity of any accusations are independent of the speaker's actions.

If someone doesn't ask for their name back, it probably means they don't want to jeopardize their eligibility for real-life competition... since you've shown a propensity for over-reacting once.
l

Nowhere in either post did it say banned. Never did. anyone who says different is a lier.

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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 10:43 pm

chrisfish wrote:
The detailed conversation i had with Chad this morning left nothing un clear study

despite the fact no one including Chris knows the whole story.

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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 10:59 pm

BBGIC wrote:
chrisfish wrote:
The detailed conversation i had with Chad this morning left nothing un clear study

despite the fact no one including Chris knows the whole story.


So you deleted his account without knowing the whole story. Aren't you part of that no one you just mentioned?
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 11:25 pm

Truth 100%

1. I was attempting to delete Chadís posts, all of them and ended up deleting his account. I took full responsibility for this. I did not know it was Chad Stoulil (yes, I do not keep up with the forums much) but that would not have changed my mind about deleting the posts. There was no way to recover the account and I thought it better to face it straight on rather than let the rumor mill flow, my first mistake. I should have just apologized instead of trying to justify it.
2. Chad was not banned, never was, and it never said so in any post I put up anywhere. People are lying, bold faced lying saying he was banned in an effort to make this thing larger than it is to push their agenda, MWSPL. Yes MWSPL. Will explain further on.

Ok, I have not seen the result of the MWSPL Finals and do not intend to. I congratulate the fine competitors who competed at their finals. I understand they had a good turnout and a good final. Steve is a good promoter so I expect nothing less. As their finals was in their back yard within a few hoursí drive of their entire competitor base I would expect a large turnout. USACI on the other hand had finals in an effort to promote the industry and moved our event several hundred miles out of our comfort zone. Chad knows that as he made the tremendous drive to the show. We appreciate the support. We expected to have low numbers as a result of the move and we did. We did not expect anyone, especially one of our own members to use this low turnout in a manner to compare us to MWSPL. Apples and Oranges to say the least.

Now the reason behind the furorÖÖ

Chad Stoulil, ever the loyal Midwest SPL supporter became angry at USACI when he saw that USACI had one more car at finals than Midwest SPL. Chad began making posts and accusations that would make it look as USACI had intentionally added people to our finals list to make it appear we had more cars the Midwest. This was nowhere near the truth. The JFK conspiracy had more truth to it! Chad did not call this to our attention and we had no firsthand knowledge of this prior to yesterday. Chad decided he was going to call USACI out on the USACI forums and try and make USACI look bad in an effort to support Midwest SPL and the argument that they are bigger than USACI via their finals results. I, Ralph, attempted to delete his posts an instead deleted his account. That turned into hundreds of posts, petitions, and other crap all over the internet trying to garner support for a movement to honor Chadís actions by boycotting USACI. It has been brought to my attention that Chad supports this movement and has no interest in coming clean with this.
Simple Truth
1. Chad was deleted by accident
2. I made an ill advised attempt to support my deleting him and it went wrong
3. Several people are lying saying Chad was banned. Never happened. Never happened. Any who says it did is a mid informed or just lying to stir the pot.
4. After all the actions today, Chadís reaction, and the posts here on the forums I think Chad has succeeded in his effort s. Congratulations.
5. Did I mention, Chad was never banned?
6. Who asked Chad to beg for his account back? WTF is that about?
7. I posted the finals results. I have never seen Midwest SPL result so I cannot say how many cars they had. I can say that our posting of finals results, and or any mistakes on that posting had nothing at all to do with Midwest SPL. (Since Chad was the only car in his class we should have put some names in there!) Just kidding.

This is about USACI versus Midwest SPL and one competitor using his position in one organization to further the other. The rest is smoke and mirrors. Most of those who feel they are doing what they are as loyal supporters of Mr. Stoulil should look at what they are standing up for and who really has something to gain by turning my deletion of a members account into a grass roots campaign to kill USACI. Surely not me.

I may lose my temper and make mistakes, but I own them and take the crap for them. I have been USACI for 26 years and will continue to support the sport regardless of the insider attacks. I am truly sorry if I have disappointed our members or supporters. I took the actions I thought were proper and despite the drama I am confident given all that has come to light that it was justified. Several of you asked not to mention you here for fear of the same reprisals I have been suffering and I will not mention your names but I want you to know that your letters have been a big help for me today. Thank you for your support.
I am not too familiar with the forum because I avoid it most of the time. Every time I get on here and read the post I log off depressed and regretting logging on in the first place. Reading this forum is many times the worst way to start my day. This particular time as in many others this forum has served to do far more damage to USACI than good. I hate the negativity, the politics, and the posts that serve no purpose than to hurt USACI. If a competitor does not like USACI they have multiple choices with other organizations. Choosing to hang out here and use the unrest to further other organizations is not acceptable and will not be allowed.

This issue is closed. KickerCRX has been deleted and will stay that way based on the events of today. Cyber Terrorisms will not change my mind. Chad Stoulil is not banned and never was yet I do not expect to see him at any USACI shows soon. That is Chadís choice. I wish him the best as on a personal level I, like many, like Chad. To those of you who decide to boycott USACI, I disagree with your decision but sincerely whish you the best of luck in your future organization(s).




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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Thu Nov 01, 2012 11:29 pm

Jeff Sanford wrote:
BBGIC wrote:
chrisfish wrote:
The detailed conversation i had with Chad this morning left nothing un clear study

despite the fact no one including Chris knows the whole story.


So you deleted his account without knowing the whole story. Aren't you part of that no one you just mentioned?

Yes I was. I did not intend to delete the account. There is a "Banned" button to ban a person. I intended to delete all his posts rather than spend hours searching them out. I hit "Delete ALL" and it did. I could not recover it so I posted why it happened, not how. The rest is left to Freddy Kruger and his joke of a nightmare. He could take lessons on this forum!

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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 12:02 am

basscort11 wrote:
gets called out on an innapropriate ban.... tries to backtrack and say everythings good.... seems legit

And I do not know who is behind this screen name either. But if I decided to ban you all the posts in the world nor posts like this one would change my mind regardless of who you turn out to be.

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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 12:05 am

chrisbaldelli wrote:
So... let me interpret your first post (now edited):
Someone gets the ban-hammer. They choose not to beg for their name back. They must have made the whole thing up and are guilty.

Your logic is flawed. The validity of any accusations are independent of the speaker's actions.

If someone doesn't ask for their name back, it probably means they don't want to jeopardize their eligibility for real-life competition... since you've shown a propensity for over-reacting once.

Based on what he has said publicly about his intentions my reaction was right on. The rest of your post is incorrect.

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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 2:32 am

Thanks for the thorough discussion.

1) Don't stress over the account thing. It's just a name on the internet. The backlash is about the underlying issues that he brought up, and how they were written off as treason rather than worthwhile discussion points.

2) The admin buttons are not labeled the same as the traditional definitions. Time to drop some Wikipedia:
LINK to Banhammer

In Internet forums and online multiplayer games, the host of the game often has the power to ban players who do not follow the rules, or who make little effort to get along with fellow players. When banned, the user is unable to reconnect to the server. In some cases, especially in games which use account systems, the user may create a new account to attempt to bypass the ban system.
IP address banning (sometimes called 'blocking' or 'permabanning') is commonplace in internet culture. The "banhammer", "banstick", or "banbomb" is a metaphorical tool used in popular culture. For instance, a moderator or host is sometimes said to "wield the banhammer" against disruptive individuals.

If I've lied, then I apologize. Those who live on tha intranetz rarely leave their keyboard-filled caves.

3) Comparing USACi and MWSPL next year is a red herring (irrelevant argument). I'm sure things will be better next year too. Double entendre.

4) Basscort01's post was indeed making fun of the situation... but with regard to an internet meme. Time to drop some KnowYourMemes:
Link to Seems Legit

5) No one is trying to kill USACi. Some people may troll, but many of us speak our minds because we remember "the good old days" and want to see them return. Chad cared deeply about the car audio industry, and wanted the mutual success of both MWSPL and USACi. Alot of his advice was ignored, just like much of the recent discussions regarding class structures.

Sadly, Chad is dead, so it's irrelevant. On a lighter note, he successfully recreated the JATO Rocket Car. RIP.

This is another discussion for another day, but when a business transitions from "cash cow" to "dog" then it's a good idea to re-assess the marketability of the product.

Measures of success:
Competitors - turnout, number of shows, creativity/innovation
Organizers - sustainability, net increase in total value, sponsor involvement
Sponsors - advertising, return on investment
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 3:37 am

fornicate this org. MWSPL for now on. That way I dont have to listen to everyone whine \"Female dog\" moan and groan. Even the man in charge. I am getting to old for all the BS that goes on here in this org.
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 7:52 am

chapdawg1971 wrote:
chrisbaldelli wrote:
The Bald One's actions were somewhat justifiable... considering the seriousness of the accusations being thrown around. He has the power to act however he sees fit.

The members have the power to leave if they disapprove of USACi's actions, though.

If we're complacent with this, and don't demand some evidence or justification... it just means that we passively agree with USACi. That's fine, but Chad doesn't seem to be a sadist or a pathological liar.

How about some transparency? We're smart enough to read and decide if everyone's upfront and honest.

Did we fluff some numbers, unfairly support certain vendors, improperly schedule events, forget to pay taxes, miss some world records, etc. Even if we did something, was it for self-preservation or for profit? Until the facts get out there... the whole organization's credibility is left to chance.

Guy, stop with all of the "big word" talk. While you're at it spit the SA CK out. It is what it is. How many times did Ralph log in or even look when Alan mentioned change in the org.

Know what? We haven't gotten some input from the Man's mouthpiece himself on this one.

Odd?

Actually I logged in and read the posts several times.

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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 8:01 am

Kickercrx wrote:
fornicate this org. MWSPL for now on. That way I dont have to listen to everyone whine \"Female dog\" moan and groan. Even the man in charge. I am getting to old for all the BS that goes on here in this org.

I am sorry you feel that way but glad to see you logged in, if it is Chad.?.
It is a shame all of eh drama here, and even more of a shame since you are at the center of the biggest drama in years. I wish I could say fornicate it too but
I cannot. I love this organization and this sport. 26 year in the can and I'm still sticking to it. Thats more years than many of you are old.

I am however sorry it happened this way ( thus the waking up and posting early am ) and I hope one day you can get past it and see that what I did while perhaps quick tempered or rash was done with the best interests of USACI in mind.

Good luck in MWSPL. I hope you do well and do not forget it is about fun, not nitpicking the little things to the point it is no longer fun, for anyone.

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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 8:22 am

chrisbaldelli wrote:
Thanks for the thorough discussion.

1) Don't stress over the account thing. It's just a name on the internet. The backlash is about the underlying issues that he brought up, and how they were written off as treason rather than worthwhile discussion points.

2) The admin buttons are not labeled the same as the traditional definitions. Time to drop some Wikipedia:
LINK to Banhammer

In Internet forums and online multiplayer games, the host of the game often has the power to ban players who do not follow the rules, or who make little effort to get along with fellow players. When banned, the user is unable to reconnect to the server. In some cases, especially in games which use account systems, the user may create a new account to attempt to bypass the ban system.
IP address banning (sometimes called 'blocking' or 'permabanning') is commonplace in internet culture. The "banhammer", "banstick", or "banbomb" is a metaphorical tool used in popular culture. For instance, a moderator or host is sometimes said to "wield the banhammer" against disruptive individuals.

If I've lied, then I apologize. Those who live on tha intranetz rarely leave their keyboard-filled caves.

3) Comparing USACi and MWSPL next year is a red herring (irrelevant argument). I'm sure things will be better next year too. Double entendre.

4) Basscort01's post was indeed making fun of the situation... but with regard to an internet meme. Time to drop some KnowYourMemes:
Link to Seems Legit

5) No one is trying to kill USACi. Some people may troll, but many of us speak our minds because we remember "the good old days" and want to see them return. Chad cared deeply about the car audio industry, and wanted the mutual success of both MWSPL and USACi. Alot of his advice was ignored, just like much of the recent discussions regarding class structures.

Sadly, Chad is dead, so it's irrelevant. On a lighter note, he successfully recreated the JATO Rocket Car. RIP.

This is another discussion for another day, but when a business transitions from "cash cow" to "dog" then it's a good idea to re-assess the marketability of the product.

Measures of success:
Competitors - turnout, number of shows, creativity/innovation
Organizers - sustainability, net increase in total value, sponsor involvement
Sponsors - advertising, return on investment

Interesting post, particularly the links. I had no idea "seem legit" was sarcasm. I thought it really meant it seem legitimate. Duh.

As for Chad, I sent him an e-mail. Tried to message on facebook but I have been banned from his account (yes, you can start laughing now) ironically and was unable to contact him there.

As for my handling of the situation It could have been better. I could and and should have Called him and dealt with it personally. If I was aware prior to the incident who it was I might have but as I have not time machine I cannot go back and change it. He re established the account so it was obviously not banned. He said a piece that while upsetting is not subversive in any way and does not require deletion.

I am not perfect. I make mistakes. Those things I am guilty of. As for USACI, my intentions are to be loyal to the organization and the competitors. I may appear to not care at times but I really do. I do not come here too often as it really does get to me all the negativity. Most of our director and moderators agree and have avoided the forums as of late for the same reason. just reading the posts here makes them feel like I do. I can only imagine how that effects new people looking for a place to play.

For the record I am either greedy or authoritarian. One or the other guys. If I am greedy I cannot and will not run off multiple competitors (membership and entry fees) over my integrity. If I am the other then I use my power over my greed and as such greed is not a driving force.

In reality, just a guy who has given 26 years to this organization and who hopes to be around a while longer.

Ralph

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Upzaw2000
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:51 am



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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 11:53 am

WOW ......................such drama over a sport , no million dollar contracts , only plastic trouphies , rings , etc.......for us . for ralph it is a buisness . It is nothing like it was in the hay day , but still a buisness . Chad i have known as well as ralph since 05 . do i agree with them all the time ? nope..........................but keep in mind how both of them look at thing , from oposit side of the table. Chad spends crazy time and money to build a vehicle that goes buzzzzz for seconds at a time , it takes alot of time and money , he does this for reasons i dont personaly know , it could be to keep himself out of trouble , or because he is very competetive , or just because he is bored with money to burn,,,,,,,, thats his buisness , not mine . that being said he is like most of us wanting instant gradification ..... shows done lets see results ....., rules that are followed by all usaci staff the same at all shows .... rules that are easy to understand by all , that being said all rules have gray lines ... those who walk that line tend to win ......but enforcement of these rules need to be upheld . i did not read what chad said but i know he like all of us can and do get carried away some times As for ralgh ...right or wrong this is his org , he is in caharge , i dont always agree with what he says or does but i always call him with most isues instaed of posting my issues .....he did come on here and face book to publicly explain/appologize to chad , that take a big man to do . any of us that say we dont make mistakes is a liar.....so i give him credit for that , as well as chad , if he truly believes he is in the right 100% then he is doing what he thinks is right so i will support him also . just remember for us this is a sport for ralph it is more . he has seen competetors come and go over the years , he has seen the high of the sport as well as the low .......
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 1:32 pm

BBGIC wrote:
Kickercrx wrote:
fornicate this org. MWSPL for now on. That way I dont have to listen to everyone whine \"Female dog\" moan and groan. Even the man in charge. I am getting to old for all the BS that goes on here in this org.

I am sorry you feel that way but glad to see you logged in, if it is Chad.?.
It is a shame all of eh drama here, and even more of a shame since you are at the center of the biggest drama in years. I wish I could say fornicate it too but
I cannot. I love this organization and this sport. 26 year in the can and I'm still sticking to it. Thats more years than many of you are old.

I am however sorry it happened this way ( thus the waking up and posting early am ) and I hope one day you can get past it and see that what I did while perhaps quick tempered or rash was done with the best interests of USACI in mind.

Good luck in MWSPL. I hope you do well and do not forget it is about fun, not nitpicking the little things to the point it is no longer fun, for anyone.

Thats the thing. This org is all about nitpicking. That is why for the past few years it has been getting closer and closer to its death.
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 1:48 pm

I got a email from "the real" Chad this morning telling me that the KickerCRX that signed up this morning is not him on the forum. Just letting everyone know.

Thanks

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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 2:06 pm

info for current kickercrx......


Country name: United States
Area: Nebraska
City: La Vista
Postal code: 68128
latitude: 41.1765
longitude: -96.0613
Host: 71-34-198-65.omah.qwest.net
IP: 71.34.198.65
email:chadstoulil@gmail.com

If it is not Chad, anyone know who it might be?

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Upzaw2000
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PostSubject: Re: KicxkerCRX   Fri Nov 02, 2012 2:09 pm

Bahamas now Dung Pile gets real confusing.

If anybody it's prolly quad. Lol
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